255 The Someday Treatment Plan

Welcome to the KC CHIROpulse Podcast.  

This week’s topic:  The Someday Treatment is Killing Your Profits 

The KC CHIROpulse Podcast is designed for Chiropractic professionals ready to elevate their practice to new heights.  This week, the show is hosted by Kats Consultants’ coaches Dr Michael Perusich and Dr Troy Fox, seasoned experts in Chiropractic business management.  This podcast provides invaluable insights and actionable strategies to help you create a flourishing and sustainable Chiropractic business.

In this episode, we discuss:

• How the someday treatment plan quickly depresses your profits
• Why patients are confused when you tell them to return someday
• How your doctor authority is impacted when you recommend PRN
• Why the someday treatment plan is a sign of poverty complex
• …and so much more…

In each episode of KC CHIROpulse, we delve into crucial aspects of building a successful Chiropractic practice, covering topics such as establishing a strong foundation, adopting a patient-centric approach, mastering marketing techniques, achieving financial fitness, fostering effective team building and leadership, integrating technology and innovation, and navigating common challenges in the field.

Whether you're a seasoned chiropractor or just starting your practice, the KC CHIROpulse Podcast offers a wealth of knowledge and personalized practical advice to help you navigate the intricate world of Chiropractic business. Join us on this journey as we explore proven strategies, share success stories, and connect with industry experts to empower you in your pursuit of building a thriving Chiropractic practice.

Don't miss out on the latest insights and expert guidance. Subscribe now and unlock the secrets to taking your Chiropractic practice to the next level. Your success is our priority at Kats Chiropractic Business Advisors.

DISCLAIMER:  The information presented in this broadcast is for educational purposes only and is not intended to offer legal, investment, accounting, or medical advice, and represents the opinions of the speakers.  Seek the consultation of a professional for advice in those areas. And remember…your results using this information may be different than described.

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Transcript

255 The Someday Treatment Plan

[00:00:00] 

Dr. Michael Perusich: doctors are your treatment plans about Call me maybe.

All right, everybody. Welcome to the KC and ChiroPulse podcast. You can tell we're gonna have some fun today. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Oh, yeah. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: So I'm Dr. Michael Perusich. This is, uh, Dr. Troy Fox. We are your host today as most days. And, uh, and I want to thank Chiro Health USA for being one of our sponsors as we, as we dive in here.

But you know, Troy this topic is such nails on a chalkboard for both of us. 

Dr. Troy Fox: It is. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: When doctors don't wanna make a recommendation they're scared to make a recommendation or they don't wanna make a recommendation. I mean, there's probably a bazillion reasons, and they just tell the, the patient, call me when you feel like it.

Dr. Troy Fox: Yeah. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And what am I thinking as a patient? Did my doctor just quit me? I what? 

Dr. Troy Fox: Yeah. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: What do you mean call you? I don't know when to call you. 

Dr. Troy Fox: What are the parameters? Yeah, what are the parameters for when I'm supposed to call the, so they come up with their own idea. And quite frankly, that's poor vision by the doctor.

It's poor care for [00:01:00] the patient. And we look at it as, and I hear this often, so this is why it's nails on a chalkboard for me. A lot of you, it's poverty complex. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: It is, 

Dr. Troy Fox: and doctor authority, you either lack doctor authority or you have poverty complex or both. And we're gonna talk about both of those.

But man, it drives me insane when somebody, Brian drives up in a new Lincoln Navigator, just got their nails done, has diamond rings on every finger, and you're going, gee, I don't know if they can afford my treatment plan. How about you just call me when you want. It happens. And if you're honest with yourself, all of us have done it.

At some point or another, we've underestimated a patient and said, we'll do such and such. I even had one the other day that I literally told the guy we were working with some plantar fascitis and I wanted to try a treatment with him. And he, he was kind of a newer guy and I said, listen, I wanna do this and then I'm gonna put you on the schedule next week.

And I hadn't created a treatment schedule for him yet 'cause I wanted to see how he responded, day one to the treatment. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Sure. 

Dr. Troy Fox: And [00:02:00] he literally almost scolded me because I didn't put him on a treatment schedule. And then I explained to him why I wasn't, but he's like, money is not an object. I'll do whatever you tell me to do, doc.

And I thought, wow, wouldn't it be nice to know when our patients already have that in their heads? But he actually verbalized it and it's like, why aren't you putting me on a treatment schedule? Yeah. So him and I said, I am going to the next visit. I see you today is evaluation. A little bit of treatment 'cause I wanna see how your body responds to this and whether we're going down the right track, right off the bat.

'cause I was telling him what I'd like to do is, my goal is, is I, I don't throw the kitchen sink at you if I don't have to. Sure. And that's the goal, right? With all of our patients. We wanna be fair and honest with them. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Mm-hmm. Exactly. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Yep. So don't need to ha we don't also don't need for them to pull up their online account for their banking and show you how much is in their account before you make recommendations.

It's not your job, it's down their pocket. All right. Ran over. That was, that was part of the call. Me maybe. [00:03:00] Thing that really drives me insane when docs try to get in people's pockets and understand how much money they have. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And, and, and like you said, Troy, I mean, there's absolutely no reason to do that.

Be a doctor, have the authority and make your recommendation. So we need to take a, uh, one of those break. We need to take a quick break. We need to take a break thing, um, and hear a quick word from our sponsors. But, uh, when we come back, I wanna dive into this just a little bit deeper. Alright? We'll be right back everybody.

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All through a compliant discount medical plan. The result, doctors stop undercharging, raise fees, and increase income by about 20% without sacrificing care. [00:04:00] That's not a discount strategy. It's a business strategy. Learn more at chirohealthusa.com

Dr. Michael Perusich: Okay, welcome back everybody. We are talking about the call me maybe treatment plan, thought process. We also call it the PRN mindset. And Yep, you know, it just, in my opinion, this just doesn't have a place. In the Chiropractic world, you know, you go to a general surgeon and they take out your gallbladder, and once your gallbladder's out and there's no infection and you've healed up, there's nothing left for them to do as far as the gallbladder goes.

So PRN makes sense. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Yes. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: But how does it make sense in the Chiropractic world? I mean, when we think about how the spine actually works, you know, with a bunch of vertebra, a bunch of bones stacked on top of each other with a marshmallow in between, and you think about things like the physiological law, wolfs law, where abnormal pressure on normal tissue causes plastic deformation, which is what we see all the time in the spine.[00:05:00] 

And you think about what our patients are doing and, and the culmination of what they've done before they get to your office. Where in the world does PRN come from? Because what's the patient gonna do once they're out of pain? They're gonna go back to doing whatever brought 'em into your office in the first place.

Whether it's an overuse syndrome at work, too much golf, too much bowling. Standing at the kitchen counter, you know, whatever it might be, bending over and changing diapers, whatever it might be, is gonna continue to cause insult to that spine. And this just is representative, in my opinion, of the ongoing need for Chiropractic care.

Dr. Troy Fox: Absolutely. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: That was a so statement. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Yeah, and I, I mean that, that, that soapbox statement is perfect because the truth of the matter is, is who are we to take something that takes time and repetition. And, we famously used the, uh, the Journal of Spine that talked about it taking a full 18 months.

For a [00:06:00] joint to heal. And we've, we've talked a little bit about that in other podcasts as well. Yep. The truth of the matter is, is you, we all know it takes time and repetition. If you know, if we were able to heal people in one visit, a, we'd walk on water, uh, b, there'd be people lined up around the block to your office.

There are the occasional situations where you take somebody that's had pain for 30 years and you adjust 'em one time and their pain's gone. Does that mean the joint's healthy at that point? Let's be honest with ourselves. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: No, of course 

Dr. Troy Fox: not. Take time and repetition to get a joint to respond. So the call me maybe, or that PRN mindset goes against good judgment of care for patients.

So I look at it from a standpoint of saying, have you done the patient a disservice if you just drop 'em after one visit and go, well, you just call me. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Yeah. You know, maybe, maybe gimme a call if the pain comes back. And, and so now we, now what we've done is we've made ourselves an owie proctor. And if you have a pain management clinic, that's fine.

I'm not, I'm not saying that's necessarily a bad thing, but if that's [00:07:00] just your overall approach to Chiropractic care is okay, got you outta pain, you know, that took four or five visits, got you out of pain. And you know, I understand now that you don't see a need for further care. So, potentially give us a call if it comes back sometime, but here's what happens in the patient mindset.

Okay? You treated them, the pain stays away for two to four weeks maybe, and it starts to come back. What does the patient start to think? Do they start to think, oh, it's just time for another Chiropractic adjustment? Or do they start to think, is this Chiropractic stuff really working? 

Dr. Troy Fox: Or is the Chiropractor door that I'm going to really working Exactly.

How many times have you and I, and I've seen it many times where a patient comes to me. I had one last week. When was the last time you got adjusted? Monday and it was Wednesday. I go, why are you seeing me? Because I heard from my friends that you do rehabilitative care. [00:08:00] You spend time with patients until you get their condition better.

The Chiropractor I went to just adjusted and said, call me again if you need me. True story. Yeah. I mean, I didn't make this, I didn't make this up today for this podcast. I could have because it's happened many times in the past, but this actually happened last week and. The guy that I was talking to was a very educated person that just said, listen, I already understand how Chiropractic works.

I've spent a lot of time looking at it online. And he goes, I think it's fascinating. He goes, but I don't understand it. The one treatment model that to me it doesn't make sense. So here's a person of lay you know, lay 

Dr. Michael Perusich: a layman. 

Dr. Troy Fox: You know, they're a layman that is telling me that he doesn't understand a single treatment model.

And I'm like. Man, boy isn't that a breath of fresh air? And I'm like, well, it's bad for the other Chiropractor that really? And I said, well, what did you think of the adjustment from the other Chiropractor? It was fine. Mm-hmm. I just didn't understand why he didn't have me come back. So he goes, so I've talked to friends and [00:09:00] I called you.

You know, sometimes the, the Chiropractic, and I hate it when chiro PR dick. It takes it under, you know, you get thrown, Chiropractic gets thrown under the bus because somebody doesn't get better. The pain comes back. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Yep. 

Dr. Troy Fox: But it's not much better when the Chiropractor door gets thrown under the bus because then we hear you and I hate when I see this on Facebook.

You guys have all seen it before. Who's a good Chiropractor to go to? Oh, man, come on. We're all good chiropractors. Of course. I don't be out there that aren't good chiropractors. We're all a little different in how we practice, but we're good chiropractors. But look what that created and I believe that part of it is because of that PRN mindset.

Dr. Michael Perusich: Yeah, and I think, you know, your, your patient who. Got adjusted on Monday and is back on Wednesday. Understanding that, you know, one, the one and done idea isn't always a good plan. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Mm-hmm. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Um, I think more and more people are getting that. Yeah. And there's so many people out there that are looking for a long-term [00:10:00] solution that helps them maintain function.

Dr. Troy Fox: And are willing to pay for. It's the thing. They're like, Hey, I'm fine with paying for care as long as it keeps me functional and mobile, which goes back to ADLs, which goes back to why we're treating the patient anyway. It's not pain, it's function. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And that, that, that, that's primary, not primarily that's what we do.

Dr. Troy Fox: Yeah. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: We are about the long term function functionality of the human frame, and we're kind of the only ones out there that do it. I guess the PTs could, um, but they're, they're so. They're so pain and post-surgical focused, which is fine. That's a great market. Um, they, and they can have it, as far as I'm concerned, we're, we're about the entire kinetic chain, right?

And so when you take that into consideration and if you really dig into a patient's history and all the things that they're doing that create that repetitive joint trauma over time, microtrauma I don't even understand where the four week model for maintenance care came [00:11:00] from. Even that, to me doesn't make sense.

I mean, Troy, how often do you get adjusted? 

Dr. Troy Fox: I get adjusted every week as a bunch of my patients because we'll offer it. And you, you always told the great story about how you're, somebody goes, how often do you get adjusted? And you were like, every week. And they're like, well, why am I not getting adjusted every week's exactly 

Dr. Michael Perusich: what happened?

Dr. Troy Fox: Hey, and there are some people that go, oh, there's no way. I would come once a week. And there's some people that say, financially, I can't afford that. And that's fine. But a cadence of care is developed based off of what you need. And here's the thing. My recommendation to you, because two things, Mike, as I work with you, number one, I work for you.

And number two, we work together as a team. As I make recommendations to you, you're gonna evaluate those and tell me what you think, and that's how the teamwork approach goes. So if I say I'm gonna see you every day for the rest of your life, you might look at me and go, you're crazy. But if I, if I look at you and say, I'm gonna see you weekly because you've got a pretty chronic condition that requires care and you're really functional when you get seen weekly.

You may go. I think [00:12:00] that's a great idea and I'm willing to do that. So when you are doing a negotiation, and it is a negotiation because you, you are gonna have patients that go, I can't, man. I'd love to do weekly doc. If I could be in here every day, I would. Right? You got patients like that? 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Sure. Yeah. 

Dr. Troy Fox: But you're gonna do a negotiation and the patient's gonna say, you know what, I get paid every two weeks and I can get adjusted every two weeks, and it is valuable for me to do that.

We've determined a cadence of care, not only based off of their finances, but the original reason for the cadence of care, which was, you know what, you'd really benefit if I could see you weekly, but I'll, we play Monte Hall, let's make a deal because mm-hmm. Here's the thing, I can't twist your arm if you don't have the finances to get adjusted.

You don't. If you're honest about it and you get paid every two weeks, well guess what? I'm gonna meet you in the middle and we're gonna keep you as functional as we can. So there, there's a real art to finding out that cadence of care for patients long term. And now there's, now there's not a call me maybe.

Right. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Right. And there's, there's an art to [00:13:00] explaining to patients too, why. That once a week type care, if you will is important. And I would always tell patients after that experience I had, 

Dr. Troy Fox: yeah. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: When the patient asked me, how often do you get adjusted? Which was a big light bulb that went off for me, but Right.

I used to use that all the time. You know, I get adjusted every week. My staff would tell patients, oh, they get adjusted at least once a week. I mean, Mars would sometimes get adjusted three times a week. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Right. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And. PE people would look at us and go, well, well, you're really healthy. Yeah. 'cause we get adjusted more often and we give you access to that if that's what you want.

Right. Um, and so I, I realized early on that I needed to make my recommendations for wellness care not on the four week cycle or the. Every quarter cycle, like I hear some docs do. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Mm-hmm. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: I started making my recommendation, so my recommendation is every week. If that doesn't fit into your lifestyle or your finances, that's fine.

We can try every two weeks, we can try every three weeks, but I, I would rarely let anybody go past four. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Mm-hmm. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Most of my [00:14:00] patients, I'm gonna tell you, probably 75% of the patient visits I saw every month, which I saw a high volume of patient visits like you did Troy. Um. 75% of them were coming in once a week or every two weeks.

Dr. Troy Fox: Mm-hmm. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And you know, it took me a while to really get them there, but. Not because it wasn't my recommendation, it was my recommendation for a long time. And so this is where it comes back to doctor Authority. And I think we have to not be afraid to make the recommendation that's right for the patient.

The patient can choose something else and we can help them choose something else that may be maybe a little bit of a blanket for them and, and still provide some aid And, functional improvement on a slower or smaller basis, but we've gotta, we've gotta not be afraid to have that authority to make those recommendations, period.

Yeah. 

Dr. Troy Fox: If you're only recommending weekly care to a, the person that came to you and said, I, I, the last Chiropractor I went to, I was getting adjusted [00:15:00] weekly. Oh, great. Let's put you on weekly care. Or even worse, you say, well, let's see you once a month here. Yeah, they've been getting adjusted once a week.

They're telling you I want adjusted once a week. So if, if those are the only peoples, the people that come to you and tell you, I've been getting adjusted once a week, and or your staff, because they're not paying for care if they're the only ones that you ever make weekly recommendations to, you need to reevaluate.

'cause truth of the matter is, is you believe that they should be getting adjusted weekly or every two weeks or whatever that cadence might be for that patient. But you're not offering that because you're afraid to tell the patient the truth. As Jack Nicholson said, what? What movie was that?

When he was sitting on the stand? You can't handle the truth. Right? 

Dr. Michael Perusich: A few Good Men. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Yeah, A few good men. You can't one 

Dr. Michael Perusich: my favorite movies, 

Dr. Troy Fox: so I'm just gonna tell you once a month instead. No, we need to be forthright. We need to have doctor authority with our patients. We need to share our knowledge. That's why they're there.

People, they came to your office because they trusted you as a healthcare [00:16:00] provider. They're not asking you to make a financial decision for them. They're asking you to make a healthcare decision with them and to coach them. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And can you imagine what the patient's mindset might be if they ever found out that you told them to come in every four weeks, when in reality they really should have been coming in every week?

Think about it that direction, too 

Dr. Troy Fox: bad news. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Yeah. Now all of a sudden my doctor's not honest with me. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Misappropriation of care. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Misappropriation of care. Exactly. Yeah. So we need to take another break, but I, I want to kind of dive in a little bit more into the patient's thought process on their side when we're making that.

Well, we started off talking about the PRN mindset. Basically when we're making that PRN, you know, if the pain comes back, give us a call, thought process, that's not a treatment plan. I wanna talk a little bit more about that. So quick order from our sponsors, we'll be right back.

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Dr. Michael Perusich: All right, everybody, we are back and we're having a great time today talking about nails on a chalkboard. Yeah. Yes. It just gave everybody chills up their spine. Um, no, seriously, we're talking about not using doctor authority to make proper recommendations with patients and. You know, I, if I sat here and thought about it when I was very, very first in, in practice, sometimes I would do that for a patient who was coming in and had been going to another Chiropractor, and maybe they told me that, you know, they just, they just tell 'em, you know, I just come in when I want to.

Because I was new in practice, I wasn't real sure how to handle that. So I worked and worked and worked early on trying to figure out how do you handle that. And I worked with my coach, his, you probably heard of him, his name's Dr. Katz on how to, how do you handle that? 

And so we figured it out.

But what I realized was. [00:19:00] There's a whole bunch of people who get the wrong impression of Chiropractic if we do that. If we just allow them to pick their schedule, or if we tell them a schedule that doesn't make sense to 'em. And I'm telling you, just like Troy had the patient that. He was talking about a minute ago.

People are onto us. People know that repetition is important. They just don't know what that repetition should be for them. So let me ask you guys this out there. Think about this. Does the dentist ever tell a patient that they only brush their teeth once a month? I only brush my teeth once a month, so you know, you could probably get by with the same thing.

No, they don't ever say that. So they make the recommendation to brush your teeth, your teeth three times a day and floss every day for a reason, because that's what you need. Now, do we always do that? No, of course not. But we need to make the same kind of recommendations to patients. We need to tell the patient, you know, you really should be in here with the condition of your spine.

You really should be in here [00:20:00] twice a week, probably for a long time. Don't be afraid to tell them that and then let them decide. Does that work for them? 

Dr. Troy Fox: Honesty about their condition and honesty about how the human body heals and the fact that it takes a lot longer than a week for your body to truly heal.

I don't care if you're out of pain. I do. I mean, sure, I want you to be out of pain, but in the long run, pain does not dictate how I set up my care plan. Now, if you're not getting out of pain, it might dictate a change in the care plan because I want you to get to that point and, and I want you to get there quickly.

'cause that is our goal, and we're human beings and we have compassion for our patients. Or that means we, maybe we're on the wrong track. If we're not budging their pain at all, either, maybe, maybe we're, we've completely misdiagnosed the patient, we better take another look at 'em. But if we're on the right track and we're getting their pain and their pain's on the dive and it goes below threshold, I don't go, well, gee, you're healed.

What I go is, Hey, we're right on track. This is fantastic. And the truth of the [00:21:00] matter is it takes a long period of time. So here's what we're gonna do for the next six months. We're gonna see you once every two weeks and we'll reevaluate or whatever we're gonna do at that point. It is an art to get there with the patient and you have to really read the patient where they're at as well.

You will encounter a patient that will either do one of two things. I had one the other day that did this. Shook their head. Yes. The whole time I talked to 'em and the second I walked outta the room, I heard 'em say, this is what I'm gonna do. And I went, I've done everything I can. Honestly, there's no, I can't go back in there and change it.

I'm not gonna go back in there and bark at 'em and change their mind. I'd already talked to 'em. I'd already told 'em and I did a fantastic job of, of telling them what they needed to do. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Sure. 

Dr. Troy Fox: And they said, now were they far off of my recommendations? No. But it was like, I wanna be in charge. Okay. Be in charge then.

That's 

Dr. Michael Perusich: fine. Yeah. And the techniques we're talking about aren't gonna convert every single patient once a week or twice a month, or, you know, even less than four weeks, but 

Dr. Troy Fox: mm-hmm 

Dr. Michael Perusich: You're gonna go a long [00:22:00] way to creating doctor authority with patients. And, I would have people that would. Refer me patients who just wanted a second opinion about something.

Dr. Troy Fox: Mm-hmm. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Because they trusted my doctor authority to be honest about what they needed for whatever their condition was. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Right. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And and that's really what Doctor Authority is, is just being honest. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Yeah. Use Doctor Authority, get outta their pocket. My challenge to you this next week is to look at your schedule, and I'd like you to look at your schedule two months from today.

And I want you to look and tell me how many patients are on your schedule, two months from today, how many for the whole month? What do you got on there? Is it 10% of what you have this month? What you saw this month? Is it 5%? Is it dead empty right now? Some of you schedules are dead empty. Two months from now.

There isn't a person on it. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: And I'm gonna tell you 'cause you're all thinking, well, that's just how it works, Uhuh. That's not how it works. No, you should [00:23:00] have, in two months, you should have about 85% of what you're seeing right now on your schedule. Minimum. Minimum. And if you don't know how to do that.

Kats consultants.com. 

Dr. Troy Fox: That's the and, and that's where it's really at. Because if your patients are scheduled out in advance called advance multiple scheduling, you will, and you won't get a hundred percent of those either. I live in a farming community where I have some people that are just, I wanna call every month and schedule, or I wanna call every two weeks and schedule, or every week or whatever they're doing.

They will schedule each appointment individually. We have a few of those and it drives us insane 'cause it's harder for us and harder for them 'cause they don't get Sure. We even, we use little tricks like saying we want you to get your preferred time. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: Right 

Dr. Troy Fox: on the schedule. There are a little, there are a little verbal cues that we use to get people to kind of follow through.

Sometimes they won't, but the truth of the matter is, if you look out on your schedule two months from now and there is nobody or there are, there's less than, I'm gonna say, less than 25%. I'm gonna give you a little grace [00:24:00] here, all right? If you have less than 25% of what you have on your schedule this month, two months from now, Ari, if you look out, I'm gonna say you're a call me, maybe.

Dr. Michael Perusich: Yeah. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Your RN mindset, Chiropractor, and they're, 

Dr. Michael Perusich: and, and, and you may not even realize it. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Yeah. And you're bleeding patients as a result of 

Dr. Michael Perusich: that. Yeah. Yeah. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Because you got a lot of balls in the air that you're trying to juggle. I'm only trying to juggle a few. Most of the balls have already been contained in the container, and I can look at a patient and go, oh, yeah, their next appointment is blah, blah, blah.

Dr. Michael Perusich: If your schedule's empty, that's a lot more work on your staff to fill it back up and fill it back up one day at a time.

Dr. Troy Fox: Yep. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: So get rid of nails on the chalkboard. Get rid of the PR and mindset. Quit telling patients, call me. Maybe, call me. Maybe if the pain comes back, call me. Maybe if you can't play golf again, call me.

Maybe if you can't bend over and play with the kids. Get rid of the mindset. You don't need it. Use your doctor authority, make recommendations, and like Troy said a couple of times, get out of their pockets. That's [00:25:00] not your job. 

Dr. Troy Fox: Nah. 

Dr. Michael Perusich: All right everybody. This was fun. 

Dr. Troy Fox: It was, and I think it gives a lot of insight into something that, that the chiropractors talk about a lot and I think sometimes we don't understand quite why, like why this guy practiced the way that he does.

I think what I'm doing just fine. There is an easier way to practice. I can tell you this is easier. And 

Dr. Michael Perusich: way, way easier 

Dr. Troy Fox: it's, and I'm gonna go out on a limb and say it's probably more beneficial to the patient long term because there's a cadence of care and there is supportive care that goes with what they're doing rather than allowing them to decide when they should come see you.

Dr. Michael Perusich: Yep. So go check us out kats consultants.com. There's a bunch of free downloads on there. Um, we have virtual seminars coming up. We've got a live seminar coming up this fall. So, if you want to learn more about what we do and the innovative things that we do to help practices become more profitable, not just busier.

Okay, so we, we're not trying to make you busier. We're trying to help you work smarter, [00:26:00] not harder, but be more profitable. So go check us out and, uh, we'd love to see you. So, all right, Troy, thanks for being here today. From all of us here at Kats Consultants, and thanks to Cairo Health USA as well. We'll see you guys next time.

See you 

allall later.